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Dominion => General Discussion => Topic started by: josh bornstein on 02 April 2019, 12:21:06 PM

Title: Playing Exorcist on Familiar
Post by: josh bornstein on 02 April 2019, 12:21:06 PM
[Sorry if this is in the wrong forum.  I am not sure if it's a bug or if I'm just not understanding the game's rules correctly.]

I played Exorcist on a Familiar.  (which costs 3 coins + Potion).  This allows me to gain a spirit card with a lower cost. 

But when I played Exorcist on Familiar, I was allowed to gain an Imp.  I did not expect this...I was assuming that Potion cards are completely separate from all other cards.  So, for instance, I assume that if I Remodel a Familiar, I can't gain a regular 5 card like Mountebank or Festival.  I can't even remodel a 3 + Potion into a regular 3 card like Village.  Right?  I can't remodel that Familiar into a Dutchy, or a Possession into a Province.  I have a strong memory about various posts, along the line of, "Hey, a card that costs X + Potion is more 'expensive' than a non-Potion card that costs X, so why can't we remodel from Potion to non-Potion."  But maybe I am remembering incorrectly.

If my memory is not playing tricks with me; I cannot figure out why you cannot upgrade (via Expand, Remodel, etc) going from Potion to non-Potion...but you CAN downgrade (via Exorcist).  Is there a rule that specifically addresses this?

Related question: What about cards like Imp (it costs 2 plus has an "*" in its cost.  Can a 2* card be remodeled into a 3 or 4 card?  Remodeled into a regular 2 card?  Into a zero cost card???
Title: Re: Playing Exorcist on Familiar
Post by: Rabid on 02 April 2019, 12:28:02 PM
The wording matters.
"Exactly 1 more" and "up to 1 more" are different.

I like to think about Familiar as costing 3 Apples + 1 Pear.
Imp costs 3 Apples.
There for Imp costs less than Familiar.

Cards that cost 2*.
* is just a reminder, not part of the cost.
Title: Re: Playing Exorcist on Familiar
Post by: josh bornstein on 03 April 2019, 12:50:05 AM
Just played a test game.  Sure enough; you can Remodel a Potion, but cannot Upgrade a Potion (unless there are two Potion cards in the kingdom, of course, one coin apart in value).
Title: Re: Playing Exorcist on Familiar
Post by: jeebus on 05 April 2019, 04:29:02 PM
The important thing to realize is that when a card doesn't specify a cost type, it means 0 of that cost type.
Familiar costs [3$ 1p]. Imp costs [2$ 0p]. So Imp costs less than Familiar. Village costs [3$ 0p], which is also less than Familiar (since 0p is less than 1p). Exactly 1$ more than [3$ 1p] is [4$ 1p], so Familiar can be Upgraded into Golem. But exactly 1$ more than [3$ 0p] is [4$ 0p], so Village cannot be Upgraded into Golem. This last part is what you probably have misunderstood (or misremember) to mean that coins and Potions are "completely separate".

The cost of Imp doesn't really include the *, that's just a reminder. So you can Remodel an Imp into a card that costs $0, $1, $2, $3 or $4.