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Messages - ElisabetK

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Card Bugs / Re: Vassal / Throne wouldn't play
« on: 15 March 2019, 05:46:02 AM »
Okay, I was able to play a game and recreate the inconsistency in the messaging when Vassal is played.

When there is no choice of what to play, that is, when there are no action cards in my hand, the message tells me the name of the card in the discard pile. "You may play a Chapel". In the upper right are two buttons, Play Action and Don't Play. That's actually fairly straightforward.

When there is an action card in my hand (as well as actions left to play), the message says "You may play actions". The action card in my hand is highlighted; the card in the discard (which also could be played) is not. There is a single button in the upper right, Play Action, which refers to the card in the discard pile, although that is not clear. There is also an End Actions button under the log now.

The first scenario is pretty clear, even though it would make sense to highlight the card on the discard pile.

The second one though is confusing. The action card in my hand is highlighted, but the question of whether to play the card revealed by Vassal should be decided first; the interface should make that clear. I suppose the thinking is that clicking on the card in the hand is equivalent to choosing the Don't Play button and continuing the turn.

It doesn't seem to be a matter of "You may play a Chapel" taking more room than "You may play an Action". I guess it does save a click, since you can choose to not play the Vassal-revealed card and simply click on the action in your hand. I'm not sure that slight efficiency is worth the ambiguity though.

One other confusing aspect to that scenario is that the number of actions remaining is displayed on the central message, and the "You may play an action" and the "Play Action" button all use the same word, and the action card in the hand is the one highlighted. When I made the initial post there were Thrones involved which just multiplied the confusion. It seems it would be more clear to have the message say something like "you may play a [card] or play an action", and have the button read "Play card" instead of "Play action". Or have the playable card in the discard highlighted too so that it can be clicked.

Anyway I appreciate your looking at this. I'm not a complete newbie, but I am a beginner even if I've played a little over the years. I even made a couple of lengthy posts here a little over two years ago, about the interface actually. Several weeks later though I got in a situation where I couldn't play at all because a game got stuck and wouldn't end for me, and I just kind of gave up. Two years later many things seem easier, but the site still seems to be unwelcoming for newcomers. I haven't recommended it to friends. Just my two cents.

Card Bugs / Re: Vassal / Throne wouldn't play
« on: 14 March 2019, 06:06:33 PM »
Great reply, thank you.

First: including images. I'm trying this again. The image isn't showing in the preview, but this time I'll go ahead and post with the attachment and see what happens.

If you can see the image, you will notice that the Festival card in the discard is NOT highlighted like the Militia one is. That, I think, is a big part of the confusion. It genuinely looks like it isn't playable.

I honestly don't see how including the message that the Festival could be played would be limited by the space in the central information area - it's blank, and the message does appear in other cases. Of course I'm not playing with other expansions where that area might end up more cluttered. But it's an inconsistent, misleading presentation of available options from the user's point of view, if not to the programmers.

The larger point I suppose is ease of entry. I get the idea that most players, at least the ones who stick around, don't much notice the workarounds and unintuitive interfaces they have learned to deal with. They are paying attention to  playing the game, with all its mechanics and options and cards and strategies. Beginners and newcomers, though, have a rough time navigating the initial hurdles before they can really start to enjoy a fantastic game.

This reminds me of the time I was a teaching assistant for a remotely-offered intro computer programming class back in the nineties; the students had to dial in to our system instead of using the onsite Windows computers. Probably ninety percent of the questions I got were about Unix. Don't get me wrong, I love Unix, but it wasn't a Unix class and not what the students had signed up for.

Anyway, thanks again for the detailed and informative response.

ETA: Well, looks like I saved the wrong picture. This is immediately before playing the Vassal, sorry.

Support / Re: Unfamiliar Cards
« on: 14 March 2019, 03:48:16 AM »
It would be REALLY nice to have this information clearly spelled out and available in the game. The interface is unfriendly to newcomers.

Card Bugs / Re: Vassal / Throne wouldn't play
« on: 14 March 2019, 03:19:29 AM »
Update: Maybe this was just a confusing interface. I clicked on "play action" and it did play the Festival.

Usually if Vassal hits an action card it will tell me in a message what the card is, and ask if I want to play it.

Card Bugs / Re: Vassal / Throne wouldn't play
« on: 14 March 2019, 03:08:42 AM »
It's happening to me again. Game #24522571.
I'm not sure how to insert an image here so I'll just describe what is happening.

I've got two actions, and a Militia and Vassal in my hand. I play the Vassal and a Festival is discarded but there's no option to play it; the Militia is highlighted and the "play action" button is available.

Once again I've tried backing up with undo, reloading the page, closing and reopening the browser, all to no avail.

The game log indicates that the correct behavior is an option, it's just that there is no way to choose the Festival. So maybe it's an interface issue. Anyway, here is the game log:

Turn 18 - ElisabetK
E plays a Laboratory.
E draws a Festival and a Laboratory.
E gets +1 Action.
E plays a Festival.
E gets +2 Actions.
E gets +1 Buy.
E gets +$2.
E plays a Laboratory.
E draws a Militia and a Vassal.
E gets +1 Action.
E plays a Vassal.
E gets +$2.
E discards a Festival.

It's your action phase, you may...
• play an Action from your hand.
• You may play a Festival from your discard pile.

Feature Requests / Re: Mobile Friendly page
« on: 13 March 2019, 09:31:21 PM »
I just got an iPad and have run into problem of buttons at the bottom being cut off, which is really disappointing.

Feature Requests / Re: Post game game log
« on: 13 March 2019, 09:24:06 PM »
With all due respect, Ingx's method is a workaround, and a non-straightforward one at that.

I also would like to see a button I can click to see the game log from the score page at the end of the game. It's nice to see the hands the other players have at completion, and it's also nice to see the turn-by-turn logs, but, speaking as a learner, it would be really nice to be able to see both together or at least be able to wee them by clicking back and forth on a tab or button.

As a learner, I'd really, really appreciate that feature.

Card Bugs / Vassal / Throne wouldn't play
« on: 13 March 2019, 09:13:04 PM »
I ran into a weird situation in a bot base game last night. I had a Vassal in my hand, and playing a Sentry had showed me that my next card was a Throne. I also had some other actions in my hand.

So I played the Vassal, expecting to be able use it to play the Throne that was the next card and use that on one of the other cards in my hand. Instead, the Throne went to the discard pile and I was not given any option to play it.

I backed up using undo a few times, trying again to replay Vassal/Throne, and even backed up a couple of moves and tried replaying, but it always ended with the same result - when I played Vassal, it would discard my Throne and not allow me to play it.

I gave up on that and tried using another Throne in my hand first, so that I played Vassal twice. This time, I was given the option to use the second (pulled by Vassal) Throne card as expected, so I was able to apply it to another card in my hand. It wasn't what I wanted to do, but it worked. I tried one more time to back up and do what I originally wanted, but since it still did not give me the option to play Vassal/Throne, I backed up and played Throne/Vassal/Throne instead and continued on.

I've used search to see if similar problems have been reported, but I'm not familiar with the cards mentioned so I'm not sure if this is the same issue.

I'm also not sure if it's an interface issue (a button not appearing) or a problem with how Vassal is being interpreted. Or, for that matter, a misunderstanding on my part, although what should happen seems pretty obvious to me.

Other Bugs / Re: Game won't end with three empty piles
« on: 07 March 2017, 09:26:52 PM »
Update: right after I wrote this I went back and it let me continue playing. Turn 57 I emptied the Chapel pile (it's slow when Bandits have trashed everything bigger than copper) and the game ended. Yeah! Turns were very, very slow though.

Maybe you need to empty four piles with six players?

Other Bugs / Game won't end with three empty piles
« on: 07 March 2017, 09:18:04 PM »
I lazily ran up the score on a 6 person game - no one seemed to have enough money to buy Provinces, so I bought out Estates to end the game.

But the game didn't end, even though there were three empty piles. It continued to my next turn. Maybe I'm missing some rule, but I don't remember this ever happening.

Right about that time I had to leave for a while, so I shut my laptop. Now that I'm back, it took several times to load Dominion again, but once loaded it keeps going back to being my "extra" turn. If I end that turn, it freezes. I reload, and it goes back to being my extra turn, and the same thing happens.

I'd like to end that game so I can play another one. Obviously there's a bug in that the game didn't end with my emptying the third pile, and also that it freezes when I try taking the extra turn.

Support / Re: Resigning Mid-Game: Rant Warning :p
« on: 03 March 2017, 11:02:46 PM »
I usually play with bots but decided I had time to play a complete game with a real person, so I tried the "good match". Three times in a row I got matched with the same person, who left the table almost immediately.

If I could ban that ****, I would. I don't mind if he or she doesn't want to play with me or with that set of cards for whatever reason, but if you choose to be matched you should play the game. Just my (frustrated) opinion.

General Discussion / Tables, I just don't get it.
« on: 18 February 2017, 09:07:36 PM »
OK, I've been playing here a while now, mostly against bots though I did get some games against humans using the quick match or good match (not that those are explained anywhere outside these forums!). I've also figured out how to create a table of three or four bots to play against, once again not because the game interface led me in that direction.

Those are all games I've created myself. I'd like very much to try joining a table to play against more than one opponent, but I can't seem to do that.

The tables list jumps around so quickly that whenever I think I see what I want it has moved before I click. There doesn't seem to be any way to sort these, so even when I think I have a real possibility, if I manage to get in the table I click "ready", and either nothing at all happens ever or the host leaves. I didn't think I was that repulsive, but oh well.

On top of that there often seem to be multiple tables with the same host name. I don't ever click on those because I assume that a) the host is only actually in one place, and b) there's probably some bug and chances are 4/5 (or whatever) that it's not a real table anyway.

A little guidance on the tables page would go a long way here. I don't care about loading old games, I just want - occasionally - to play a game of three or more with a real opponent.

Sorry if this sounds negative, but honestly I'm frustrated.

Interface Issues / Wrong names for first turn
« on: 08 February 2017, 03:42:37 AM »
Has anyone else had this happen? When a game starts, sometimes the name in the message box in the middle of the screen is incorrect. Yesterday I was puzzled because the message displayed was "Waiting for ElisabetK" when it was my opponent's turn, not mine. He took a while; I kept looking for something I was supposed to do. Often it says it's Lord Rattington when it's a live opponent. In any case it resolves as soon as the other player does something (I think) so it's brief.

I'll have to keep a closer eye on when this happens but I thought I'd report since I don't see this posted anywhere, at least not recently.

Other Bugs / Re: "You Win" - but it's a tie
« on: 08 February 2017, 03:25:00 AM »
Seriously? I didn't know that.

Interface Issues / Re: right-click on Mac
« on: 08 February 2017, 03:22:22 AM »
This is part of why requiring right-click for anything can be maddening. We shouldn't be having to go into track pad settings to find a workaround.

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