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Messages - Ingix

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Card Bugs / Re: Tower doesn't score Knights?
« on: 15 March 2017, 09:38:59 PM »
This bug is becoming stranger. See attached the end screen of game #1951137. This game ended when three piles were empty: Knights, Tournaments and Counterfeits.

I had at the end 8 Knights (7 non-victory cards) and 2 Tournaments (checked with Log). The game did award me the Tower points in the overall sum, it just didn't show them in the end screen detailed list.

The bot had 4 Tournaments and 5 Counterfeits (not checked with Log, but my heavy use of Knights lead to a lot of trashing by the bot). The end screen shows that in the Tower description for the bot, but still only gives him 5 points for Tower in the detailed description. Again, the total sum at the top acknowledges the additional 4 points due to the Tournament.

I guess the problem occurs when you have more Scheme effects at end of turn than cards to apply them to. That's why Throne Room + Scheme is not a problem (2 effects, 2 action cards), but Kings Court + Scheme is (3 effects now, but still only 2 cards). I checked Procession + Scheme and this also hangs (2 effects, 1 card).

Interface Issues / Re: Royal Carriage "Done Reacting"
« on: 13 March 2017, 02:47:48 PM »
I think most of the Reserve cards would profit from an on screen representation that shows them 'activateable' at the correct times.

For example, if you just resolved a Rebuild, the client would mark all all CotR's and Royal Carriages as activateble (maybe with the little plus sign), but would still allow you to play Action or Treasure cards from your hand, just like if you had no reserve cards.

This way, the optional effect is still doable, but you have to actively use it (by clicking on Royal Carriage/CotR) instead of the way it works now where you have to actively decline it if you don't want to use it. This would get rid of Adam's cases where he has to decline further Royal Carriages.

Of course, this doesn't solve Markus' cases where an action has just been resolved and the game is scheduled to continue with something else instead of a player having to decide what to do anyway.

AI bugs / Re: Bot not receiving/using coins from Butcher
« on: 10 March 2017, 09:36:04 PM »
I can partially confirm this. I set up a game with 5 AI and Butcher and watched what happens: #1828613

The following shows that the AIs do receive their coin tokens and make use of them:

Turn 9 - Scout Rush
S plays a Butcher.
S trashes an Estate.
S gains a Silver.
S plays 2 Coppers and a Silver.
S buys and gains a Library

1 coin token is used up immediately by Butcher (Estate --> Silver), 1 coin token is used when the AI buys the Library. Similar plays happened several times, sometimes with an Estate --> Silver tranformation, sometimes with Copper --> Squire

However, one turn seems to suggest that the bots at least use up their coin token, if needed or not:

Turn 15 - Scout Rush
S plays a Butcher.
S trashes an Estate.
S gains a Silver.
S plays a Copper, a Silver and a Gold.
S buys and gains a Duchy.

The AI should still have one coin token after Butcher, but it is not there at the end of the turn, even though the treasures played would be enough to buy the Duchy without using up coin tokens.

A similar thing happens in game #1829069:

Turn 8 - Scout Rush
S plays a Butcher.
S trashes an Estate.
S gains a Moat.
S plays 2 Coppers.
S buys and gains a Moat.

Again, the AI should not need to use their 2 coin tokens to pay for the Moat, but it apparently has (the client shows no coin tokens for Scout Rush when my next turns starts). An extreme case is

Turn 16 - Revenge Witch
R plays a Butcher.
R trashes an Estate.
R gains a Silver.
R plays a Copper.
R draws 5 cards.

The AI doesn't even buy a card, but still it has no coin token left after the turn.

My assumption is that the game works according to the rules (the AIs get their coin token and can use them immediately for Butcher or later for buying), but that the AI will *always* spend the coin token, even if not needed.

Interface Issues / Re: incredibly small card windows
« on: 09 March 2017, 02:31:31 PM »
Confirmed, to me it happened with Scavenger. All the cards were in singles (not all Coppers combined), though I don't remember if that was already so previously.

In what case are you experiencing some interface for ordering cards in cleanup? Is it with Scheme, or Haunted Woods or something else?

Card Bugs / Re: Tower doesn't score Knights?
« on: 07 March 2017, 01:45:56 PM »
It seems that this is a display bug in the sense that the points are taken into account when calculating the total score, but not listed in the detailed end-of-game summary. At least that's what I assume from a similar reports:


Card Bugs / Re: Multiple Watchtower React
« on: 05 March 2017, 07:46:48 PM »
I just replayed the situation, and it happened exactly as tufftaeh described. According to my understanding of the rules, it is correct up until

Now he plays another Rats, draws a Rats, trashes the gained Rats with Watchtower, draws another Watchtower, and now he is asked to react again (probably with that new Watchtower).

The game is still handling reactions to "player gained a card (Rats)", and the newly drawn Watchtower is able to react to that. But then it continues strangely:

He clicks "Trash" and promptly draws a third Watchtower. He clicks "Trash" again and draws an Estate.

Both of these draws shouldn't happen. The only conceivable reason for a card to be drawn now is that a Rats was trashed. But according to long standing rulings:

a) The new Watchtower, who expects the Rats to be in the discard pile, shouldn't be able to 'find' it in the trash (it lost track), and
b) trashing a card that's already in the trash isn't doing anything, it doesn't fullfil "if you do"-clauses and doesn't trigger a trashing-trigger

I can only assume that somehow the bookkeeping got mixed up, as finally (too late) the messages about the Watchtower loosing track come up.

Card Bugs / Re: Scheme + Herbalist
« on: 04 March 2017, 12:07:13 AM »
I'm not sure that I can follow what you want to express. There shouldn't be a lose-track issue because the treasure getting topdecked with Herbalist is not discarded but put from play on top of deck. Hence, it doesn't cover up the Herbalist in the discard pile.

We are in agreement that according to the rules, when you discard the Herbalist, 2 things trigger:

a) Its own triggered ability, which optionally topdecks a treasure,
b) the delayed triggered ability of Scheme, created when it resolved (of course, if it hasn't been used on some other discarded card before).

I would still think that you can put Gold / Herbalist in any order on top of your deck - but maybe you have to put the Gold there first. I'm pretty sure that it should be possible to topdeck both and that the interface doesn't currently allow that.

Agreed that both orders of Treasure/Herbalist on top of your deck should be possible. Also agreed, it doesn't work in the game, once you select Herbalist for Scheme, it's own ability never seems to trigger.
I tried if maybe it was because of some card order thing, because you usually have to play the Scheme before the Herbalist (a terminal). But even when I played Village, then Herbalist, then Scheme it wasn't possible.

My comment was to Lotoreo, who used the mental shortcut "Topdeck Herbalist with Scheme *from play*" in order to incorrectly conclude that the Herbalist's ability never triggered, because (in his own words)

Quote from: Lotoreo
you don't "discard it from play"anymore

What *maybe* happened in the programming is that once a card is selected for Scheme to be topdecked, it's own triggered abilities from discarding are not handled any more for whatever reason.

Feature Requests / Re: Allow saving of sets of kingdom cards
« on: 03 March 2017, 11:27:14 PM »
@jaina8851: You only need to write down the game number (it is displayed in the lower right part of the screen, like: "game #123456 on Tokyo"). Later you can come back and reload the game when you open a new table, as explained here:


If you choose decision 0, you will be right at the start of the game and can immediately start (not sure if you will have the same starting hands as before). But at least you can see your kingdom.

Feel free to ask if you need something explained, this isn't the most user friendly process at the moment.

Game Log Issues / Re: Game Abruptly Ends Without Bot Taking Last Turn
« on: 03 March 2017, 10:00:33 AM »
This is known and not a bug (as such). The idea is that the bot will of course just take a few milliseconds to do his turn (as always), then the game will end. Now, instead of showing the bot's animations, as would be done if the game hasn't ended, the game concludes that the game is over so there is no need to show anything further, and the game goes right to the ending screen.

Now I agree that if you have opted in to being shown animations, you should see them for the final turn as well.

Card Bugs / Re: Scheme + Herbalist
« on: 03 March 2017, 12:17:59 AM »
Both cards say "when you discard this/it from play" so the order shouldn't matter,
No, that's exactly the point. If you put the herbalist on top of the deck, you don't "discard it from play"anymore. Thus, use its function first, then topdeck it.

In real life play, if you choose to Scheme your Herbalist, you will just take the Herbalist from your in-play area and put it onto your deck. But technically, your are required to put it into you discard first (because it is the discard phase) and get it out from there to put onto your deck. Similiarly, if you play a Thief, technically you have to trash an opponent's treasure first and get it from the Trash into your discard. In practice, you tell the player "I want that Gold" and he will give it to you without anyone bothering to move it through the Trash.

Those "shortcut actions" become a problem when they are combined with triggers, as in this case, where a player's intuition about what should happen can become incorrect.

Interface Issues / Autobuy and Fool's Gold
« on: 02 March 2017, 11:13:13 PM »
When Autobuy is active, the game will consider a Fool's Gold only as producing 1 coin for Autobuy. This is independend from the number of Fool's Gold in the player's hand and even in play. Unlike cards like Bank, that the game will not consider at all for Autobuy and "Autoplay Treasures", Fool's Gold is used for Autoplay (where it works correctly).

An example can be seen in game #1632802, decision 188 (see screenshot). I have 3 Fool's Gold in hand, so can afford to buy the last Province. The game will not acknowledge that for Autobuy, thinking I can only generate 5 coin. Even after I play the first Fools' Gold, the game still assumes I can only generate 2 coin with the remaining Fool's Gold in my hand for autobuy.

Again, to make sure this is not misunderstood: Fool's Gold works correctly when playing the cards manually or with Autoplay, it just doesn't acknowledge the full potential for Autobuy.

Feature Requests / Streamlined discard interface for Quest
« on: 01 March 2017, 02:34:46 PM »
I suggest changing the discard interface of Quest as follows:

Display a "Don't discard" button, but also make all the cards in user's hand click-able. Let the user click on the card(s) he wants to discard. Display the "Undo" button when appropriate to allow a new choice. But the important part: Show a "Discard to gain a Gold" button only when the selected cards match what Quests requires: It must be exactly one attack or exactly 2 Curses or exactly 6 cards. In order to accommodate the rulings on Quest, in case exactly one Curse is selected or all the cards (but less than 6) are selected, display a "Discard, but gain no Gold" button (with a blood-red background or something similar so that it is understood immediately that this is not what you usually want).

A player buys the Quest event knowing exactly what he wants to discard, because there is no knew information gained during Quest's resolution. With the current implementation, he has to first select 1 of 4 buttons, then he has to select the cards to discard.

In the real life card game, I'm not announcing first that I discard Curses and then discard the Curses, I just discard them and everybody can see that I did something legal. My proposed change would bring the interface in line with the philosophy that the player should 'just' select cards as often as possible and that artificial buttons should be restricted to a minimum. Sometimes they are necessary, but in this case they are IMO superfluous.

Feature Requests / Streamline discard interface for Plaza
« on: 01 March 2017, 02:15:00 PM »
I suggest changing the discard interface for Plaza as follows.

Highlight the treasure cards (click-able) in the player's hand and display the "Don't discard" button on screen. If I want to discard, I just click on one treasure. If I don't want to discard, I click on the button.

This follows the philosophy that clicking on the treasure card in hand indicates both that I want to discard and what I want to discard. It also mimics the real life handling of that situation, where I would take the treasure from my hand and put it into the discard pile. The "Don't discard" button should IMO make it sufficiently clear that clicking on a treasure is not going to play it at this time.

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