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Author Topic: Table Checkbox - Identical starting hands  (Read 4564 times)

Offline elliottjf

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Re: Table Checkbox - Identical starting hands
« Reply #45 on: 05 June 2018, 04:33:19 AM »
Hello. I just tracked down this thread after recently posting a similar request and being forwarded Donald X's pithy response. I just want to state for the record that I completely agree with Hertz Doughnut's in-depth reply near the end of this thread. I'm among the people who always balances out the starting hands when playing IRL. And it's clear that there is at least a moderately significant population of Dominion players who share this preference and would appreciate the option for privately created tables.

Offline Funhaver

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Re: Table Checkbox - Identical starting hands
« Reply #46 on: 05 June 2018, 06:26:48 AM »
Thanks Elliott! It's nice to know there are people who think like us. :) We are in the minority on this one, though.

Offline katie_mi

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Re: Table Checkbox - Identical starting hands
« Reply #47 on: 05 June 2018, 08:06:15 PM »
I have played a lot of tournaments where this rule was implemented. If someone has 5/2 and can buy a witch in round one the other players have a definite disadvantage. So, I think this is a nice option to have and anyone is free to use it or not. 

Online josh bornstein

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Re: Table Checkbox - Identical starting hands
« Reply #48 on: 07 June 2018, 12:01:57 AM »
What has been fascinating to me, in this whole discussion, was the response of Donald X.  To his credit; he has been really straightforward about this issue.  "Nope.  Not gonna happen.  I veto it."

Fair enough.  His game, his rules.  I have no complaint with this.

But what was so interesting (I'm putting on my psychologist cap here) was the strength of his conviction.  I had expected a response like, "Well, I think it's a dumb idea.  But if you want to make the game less fun, then sure, it can be an opt-in option, for those who want it."  But the unequivocal "no!" tells me that DX really sees this option as something extremely bad for the game.  He seems to have a lot invested in this decision.

And I find that intriguing.  It seems like a pretty anodyne option to me.  (Not one that I would ever use, in my own games, by the way.)  I do not think DX needs to give further explanation.  But if he wanted to, I'd be very interested in hearing/reading his thought-process.  I've already seen scores of examples where I thought one thing about Dominion, someone with more experience says, "But what about this [fill in the blank]?"... and that brings up a point I had not even thought about.

It's all quite interesting to me.  But on a 1-to-10 scale of importance, it's not even a "one" for me.  :)

Offline LastFootnote

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Re: Table Checkbox - Identical starting hands
« Reply #49 on: 22 June 2018, 09:38:48 PM »
Hello. I just tracked down this thread after recently posting a similar request and being forwarded Donald X's pithy response. I just want to state for the record that I completely agree with Hertz Doughnut's in-depth reply near the end of this thread. I'm among the people who always balances out the starting hands when playing IRL. And it's clear that there is at least a moderately significant population of Dominion players who share this preference and would appreciate the option for privately created tables.

You say his response was pithy, but I think he does a fine job of explaining his reasoning here in detail.

There is nothing magical about the opening shuffle, any more than any other luck that's in the game. And I agree that the next shuffle is usually at least as important, and often more so. Shuffling your opening buys to the bottom is a huge disadvantage. Should we change the shuffling algorithm to avoid that next? Where does it end?

And if you always play with identical starting hands in your IRL games, well I feel like you haven't got much of a leg to stand on from an empirical evidence standpoint. How do you know it makes your games better if you do it every game?

Yeah Shuffle iT could implement this for privately created tables. There are a dozen other things that I hope they prioritize first.

But what was so interesting (I'm putting on my psychologist cap here) was the strength of his conviction.  I had expected a response like, "Well, I think it's a dumb idea.  But if you want to make the game less fun, then sure, it can be an opt-in option, for those who want it."  But the unequivocal "no!" tells me that DX really sees this option as something extremely bad for the game.  He seems to have a lot invested in this decision.

I'm guessing it has something to do with the fact that he's had this same conversation a bunch of times in the past.

Offline Emeric

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Re: Table Checkbox - Identical starting hands
« Reply #50 on: 18 August 2018, 01:18:17 PM »
Look at this log : #17434547

Starting hand doesn't mind, but turn 3 and 4 done the game !
So what !
People who asked for identical starting hands doesn't understand this game !!!!

I love D.X.V