TIL: timeout waiting for undo

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jmjm

Today I learned: if I request an undo, and the player just refuses to respond for two minutes, I forfeit the game.

That doesn't seem quite right...

Ingix

An undo request doesn't change your "4 minute clock" (after which an opponent can make you resign if you don't make a decision), that's right.

And while this seems surprising at first glance, imagine what would happen if it was the other way around. A player could indefinitely delay the game by asking for an undo, get denied, wait 3:30min, ask for an undo, get denied, wait 3:30mi and repeat etc.

Of course, a more detailed time keeping scheme may prevent that (and the discussions about what would be fair are almost as old as this service), but at the moment the "clock" runs for one player at a time, and an undo request doesn't affect this.

santamonica811

At the very least, the game could be coded so that the first time you ask for an Undo in any turn, the clock freezes while your opponent considers your request.  I'd argue that this is not only reasonable, it's almost required, as some Undo request will require your opponent to write in Chat to you, asking for more information, you'll need to write back in Chat, giving that explanation.  I can do that quite quickly, playing at my desktop computer.  But I suspect that for people playing on smaller devices or phones, it would take much much longer to do this sort of chat.

jeebus

Couldn't the clock just freeze while undo the undo is pending? (No need to only consider the extreme choice of resetting the clock.) Freezing the clock has the added benefit of giving your opponent and insentive to answer promptly.

Ingix

Yes, that sounds like a reasonable thing to do.

Ingix

There was some discussion about the "frozen clock" proposal, and it has a pitfall that I didn't see: A bad faith player can repeatedly request an undo in the same situation, and the opponent would be required to repeatedly deny it.

One proposed alternative was to time out an undo request after some time (say 1 min). If some discussion about the undo happens, it can easily be requested again. Otherwise, its clear for both players that the player who has to make a decision "is on the clock" and the undo was not granted.

santamonica811

Ingix,
I am glad to read that people are considering my "freeze the clock" idea.  Your concerns could be addressed by programing it so that the clock freezes only once per turn.